[Delaney]

Oh man, appreciate it Kent! So sorry about this – we’re a small crew that makes mistakes unfortunately. Thank you! I’ll keep you posted

[Delaney]

Love this question Jeff. It’s looking like we’ll start the calls in the new Fireside’s not this Sunday but next. Thank you for submitting!

[Delaney]

I think he definitely would say it is still the case, but that it’s too utopian to suggest it or any religion will go away. So the Yeshuan approach is a more realistic vehicle for approaching religion.

Maybe akin to saying the world would be better without sin, but it will never happen. Same sentiments.

ill pass along the question for the call in show!

[Delaney]

And “death” meaning the opposite of life. Partaking of the tree of knowledge. I do think the episodes that Kim referred to articulate the current position!!

[Delaney]

Great question!! I’ll pass along.

[Delaney]

@Kim @WMc @Lanigame As Shawn mentioned in the call in hour, we are so thankful for your responses here. It has been really cool getting Yeshuans going, and being in company with some real-freaking-deal people here. Thank you all for the comments and participation.

@Haydos Of course you as well. I imagine that it’s really difficult, especially when you might be in a phase of frustration with the church rather than acceptance of it. I’m sort of in that place still, and have a hard time being in many Christian settings because you just want to like shake people.

I am not married to someone on a different page, and do not yet have children. So I cannot speak to this at all. However I’m reminded of the ideas that God has allowed everything since Christ. God has ALLOWED IT. The more I think about that, the more shocked I am. Church is a literal manifestation of culture, it is just a societal expression of the philosophy and impetus of the moment. To see it all from such a zoomed out lens, it allows me to carry myself with less emotion through these spaces, and recognize that 1. this stuff takes SO long to implement, and 2. it happens one individual at a time. The first place it might happen is with your wife, but it also might happen with individuals in whatever church you go to, the more you speak with them.

It does, though, seem like there might be better and worse denominational fits in terms of provoking more or less frustration – especially depending on where you are at personally.

Either way, we’re here for you! Keep us posted on how things are going.

[Delaney]

We actually just discussed this question to some degree on the call in yesterday! There are some very serious associations people make between hell and living as a believer, and it takes so so long to detangle – especially if you are really focused on it.

First off – to me, it is really important that this perspective is NOT a “disbelief” in hell. It is a recognition that hell DID exist, and that is precisely what Yeshua saved us from. That distinction for some reason makes a big difference to me.

Second – at least from the speculations of the Yeshuan perspective, there IS still variation of experience in the afterlife. It is not necessarily that everyone just lands in the same experience. But that we get to choose that experience (here and there), and not be punished for what we choose. The feeling sorry for someone going to hell goes away because its more that they chose what they wanted.

Finally – I personally really call in to question this person’s association with compassion and punishment, and I think it reveals exactly what she thinks Yeshua did. Here’s how I describe the way I perceive Yeshua’s work, and how compassion for others comes into play…

God created man, gave us everything, allowed us to do what we want with it, found many ways of relating to humans along the way through their free will to the point where He finally became human to understand the experience and save us from the consequences for good. This perspective suggests we return to the garden state – meaning we are now completely free to decide the perspective through which we carry ourselves through this world. For me – when you see it this way, I can place myself in history, in humanity, recognize the utter despair that life can bring – get in real touch with the darkness that this world offers, and then experience real compassion for individuals in the dark, that we might show them light – a light that radically changes THIS life. The Yeshuan perspective, to me, really makes things about THIS life more than it makes it about the next, which is why it is so beneficial. (Christianity gets away with some horrific stuff with all of the focus being on the afterlife.)

Let me know what you think! I’m still thinking about this too…

[Delaney]

This is an awesome question and in preparing for next year (where I myself am about to have a baby), I think it’s essential that we make materials that discuss this. Along with things like being a man or a woman, being a spouse, etc.

we will discuss this both in the call in show but I’ll also get some answers from Shawn and put here! Will also put my own inexperienced thoughts from the Yeshuan perspective.

Would love to hear if anyone else has experience as well. I know @Claire navigates a marriage (without children) on two very different foundations. And @Lanigame also has a mixed familial set up.

Any thoughts Claire or Todd?

[Delaney]

Shawn on the call in hour said a few things. It depends on their level of biblical knowledge. If they’re coming from a lot of eschatological understanding, then it’s one thing. But if they are not, then perhaps just reading fresh and not putting fulfillment at the forefront – perhaps it’ll just show itself as discussion goes on!

also taking the sort of “Socratic” approach might work – where you just ask questions to them to get them to think about things, rather than saying what you know or believe.

[Delaney]

Shawn’s answer in the call in hour essentially stated that it was always that they had access to God, AND God had access to them. Once they fell and were kicked out of the garden, God could still access them, but there wasn’t the opportunity for the reverse.

does this agree with how you see it?

[Delaney]

We discussed this in the call in this week! all these questions are awesome.

simply put, Shawn identified that the other gods existed, but that there is only one “creator” God. Which is the ultimate differentiator…

thoughts?

[Delaney]

I mention the changing, because it suggests that God is working with us culturally to understand the Truth of Him today. That understanding of Him is undoubtedly affected by what came before us – it would be very proud to say we are not affected by religion before us.

But it is also affected by many other things in this world and in history. And that’s why it does not need to be part of the Protestant or Orthodox dichotomy, even though it is affected by them.

not sure, still finding words to articulate this. Love to hear your thoughts!

[Delaney]

The app gods read your mind! The like button is now incorporated into the forums and replies!

[Delaney]

Please keep suggestions coming though! Some might be fixable and some might not. Either way it’s really helpful for future development

[Delaney]

I think he does think something close to this! His thoughts have expanded a lot on what could happen in the afterlife, always preceded by “this is his own opinion/conjecture”…

I do think he thinks that where we go (as a result of our own choice) has some sort of proximal relationship – like the darker it is, the closer it is to God, in a way. I.e. getting closer to the fire of God, which purifies rather than punishes. But not sure exactly how that relates to the lake of fire. I also know he speculates on peoples souls being nearer or further from this material/earthly realm – those who don’t want to leave it might not have to.

I’m excited to discuss! And as always, feel free to call in as wells